Joel Kellner
Episode 49

Narrator: Welcome, friends, to another episode of The Story & Experience Podcast. Join your host, Japhet De Oliveira, with his guest today and discover the moments that shape us, our families, and communities.

Japhet De Oliveira: Well, welcome friends to another episode of The Story & Experience Podcast. I'm delighted with the guest that we have today. This is going to be great. I know him personally, I know him from work, and I also know him from his interactions online, which we'll hopefully will get to at some point, as well. But for anybody who's brand new today, the way it works is like this: We have 100 questions and they become more vulnerable as they get towards the end. The guest gets to choose between numbers 11 and 100 which ones they want to go to, and they will share stories and experiences that shaped them into the great leader that they are today. The first 10, I'll do. And I'll begin them right now. Hey, why don't you tell us what your name is, and is there anybody who ever struggles with your name or messes it up?

Joel Kellner: All right. My name is Joel Kellner. I'm an e-learning manager here at Adventist Health. Growing up, I would hate when people would add a second syllable to my name. Call me Jo-El, instead of Joel. It got really bad around Christmas time, when they'd say, "Jo-El, Jo-El..."

Japhet De Oliveira: I hear you. I hear you. Although, I do like that song. But maybe not if it was my name said in that way. Hey, that's great. Now you already mentioned what you do for a living, but unpack that for us. You said e-learning for Adventist Health.

Joel Kellner: Right. So I'm on the Clinical Practice and Education team. And I work with a great group of people creating online training. Some of my team helps with the EHR, some help with virtual orientation and, yeah, we create the HealthStream modules that everybody hates to take. But we try to make them as enjoyable as possible.

Japhet De Oliveira: OK, now for everybody, if you're listening to us in Denmark and you're wondering, "What's a HealthStream module?" Well, Adventist Health has its own training courses, right?

Joel Kellner: Yeah, so learning management.

Japhet De Oliveira: And you, Joel, are responsible. Oh no. They're required. They're required. Right? So you do all of these?

Joel Kellner: I don't do all of them. So some of them are purchased for people. I'm just finishing up one now on titratable meds. So I'm not a nurse or anything, but I work with ... In learning, you call them SMEs, or subject matter experts. And they're the ones that provide the content to you, and you take their content and transform it into a learning experience. And then you present that back to them and they say, "Oh, could you make this change and this change?" It's really a conversation with revisions and stuff until you get it to the final piece.

Japhet De Oliveira: Does anybody ever ask you, Joel, for the answer sheets? Yeah.

Joel Kellner: That's a good question. Yeah. I keep those hidden. You give me an Amazon gift card, maybe I'll try to track those down for you.

Japhet De Oliveira: Right, as if. That'd be great. Hey, how long have you been in this current role, Joel?

Joel Kellner: So I joined Adventist Health back in 2018. And so I was working remote in Washington state before remote was a thing. So I had a year or two years’ experience before everybody had to go home because of COVID, but yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Hey, that's great. That's fantastic. All right. And tell us, Joel, where were you born?

Joel Kellner: So I was born in Seattle, Washington. Virginia Mason Hospital. And an interesting story…

Japhet De Oliveira: I know it well.

Joel Kellner: I lived in the same house from when I was brought home from the hospital till I got married, so in Kent, Washington.

Japhet De Oliveira: Wow.

Joel Kellner: Yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira: That's fantastic. Actually, my wife's from Seattle.

Joel Kellner: Is she? OK.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah, my mother-in-law before she passed away, she used to go to Virginia Mason quite a lot with her Parkinson's. So I know that place well. Oh, my goodness. Well, I was going to say, have you been back, but you're still in the area, right?

Joel Kellner: I'm still in the area. I live in Puyallup now, so it's a little like 30 minutes south of where I grew up.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah? Been there, as well. Oh, that's great. Hey Joel, when you were a kid, what did you imagine you were going to be when you grew up?

Joel Kellner: I always wanted to be an artist. I've loved drawing since I was a kid and always had a pencil and paper in my hand. Some kids, they like to draw with crayons and markers and stuff, but I just liked pencil, ball point pen, just drawing things. I was a big Ninja Turtle fan in elementary school, so I drew Ninja Turtles. And then as I got older, it turned into sports characters, and then I wanted to learn to draw faces and people.

Japhet De Oliveira: Well, for all our listeners, you need to know this. This is how I got to know Joel. It's primarily because we would have this weekly intermission, where people would actually speak on a spiritual thought, an inspiring thought, every single week at the head office in Roseville, California. And Joel would be listening as well online, and suddenly we would get this drawing of the speaker with the key thoughts of the message and the thoughts. It's brilliant. I've actually kept every single one. And I was like, "Man, this guy's a great artist. It's great. This is really good. This is a hidden gift," which is always surprising, right? It's nice to see. So you have lots of gifts and this is one of them.

Joel Kellner: Yes. I'm thankful that God has really blessed me. I feel blessed that he gave me this talent, and I love being able to draw and share that with people.

Japhet De Oliveira: Oh, you're very good, Joel. Very good. Really, really good. I'm impressed with that. So let's talk a little bit about personality. Would people describe you, Joel, as extrovert, introvert, and would you agree with their description?

Joel Kellner: So I am an introvert inside, but I actually put on the extrovert mask in group settings, especially if there's ... Like you're in a room and everybody's just twiddling their thumbs or whatever, I'll think of what's an icebreaker that we can get to make people smile and have them have a good time.

Japhet De Oliveira: That's good. That's good. Well, I guess you need that to create also the online experience of education to make it better.

Joel Kellner: That's right. Yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira: Engagement. Yeah. Hey, that's good. Are you an early riser or a late night owl?

Joel Kellner: I would say neither, really. I like to get to bed early and I like to sleep in if possible.

Japhet De Oliveira: If possible.

Joel Kellner: Yeah. But I have four kids at home and so yeah. For a while, they were keeping me up in the middle of the night. So I would say I'm definitely not a night owl. And then waking up early, I actually have, since COVID started, to run a little bit, I don't know. Some people you have on this podcast, they get up at 4 a.m. I'll get up at 6 sometimes and go for a run for an hour or so, but...

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah. Hey, that's good. That's good. Do you like to run outside or on a treadmill?

Joel Kellner: I prefer outside. Yeah, even in Washington rain, I'll just get wet and come home and take a shower. Yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira: That's a good thing. I don't think people who have not been there understand what a good rain is, but it's a good rain. I'm with you on that. That's good. All right. So in the morning, when you get up, do you have a liquid green smoothie? Do you have a cup of tea? Do you have chocolate coffee? What's your start to the day?

Joel Kellner: So my start is an Orgain smoothie. It has almond milk, a banana, I'll put some spinach in there with ice. Definitely have to have the ice to make it cool. And then I put in the blender and that's my first thing. It's not quite green. It's more like a brownish, when you get done, because it's a chocolate flavored one, but that's how I start my day every morning.

Japhet De Oliveira: You and Daniel Wolcott will need to share recipes with each other.

Joel Kellner: OK, nice.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah, yeah. He's really into that, as well. His one's greener than your brown one, but no. Hey, that's great. Good. Let me ask you this. This morning, woke up, what was your first thought that went through?

Joel Kellner: That's a good question. So I guess I can talk about this. My wife, she's planning a surprise trip for my daughters. Their birthdays are one day apart and she's taking them to go on their very first airplane ride. That's going to happen next week and so we're trying to figure out, does she try to find her ride to the airport, or does she do the parking or whatever? So it was just a good conversation with her this morning.

Japhet De Oliveira: When you said your wife has a surprise, I thought, "Wait, it's not a surprise if you know it." But then I understand it's not about you. That's great.

Joel Kellner: Oh, yeah. No.

Japhet De Oliveira: Hey, that's good. Hey, I hope you guys work it out well. It's always fun to see kids when they go on their first ride. It's great. Hey, that's good. OK. So leadership question here. Are you a backseat driver?

Joel Kellner: Am I a backseat driver? I think, if I were to try to describe my leadership, I try to lead by example. And I don't know, I guess backseat, in far as letting people do what they need to, and then if I have a comment to say, maybe I'm speaking a little bit from the backseat. But yeah, I'm definitely not a micromanager and I'm not trying to manipulate somebody. I feel like God's given everybody their own strengths and gifts and talents. As a leader, you know what has to get done and sharing that with them, and then letting them run with it and do what they need to do.

Japhet De Oliveira: Hey, that's good. That's good. That's fantastic. All right. Good. We have hit the first 10. So now it is up to you to choose a number between 11 and 100. And let's see where the journey goes.

Joel Kellner: All right. I was thinking about this earlier, you have some people try to think prime numbers or whatever. I'm going to do sports numbers, so...

Japhet De Oliveira: OK. All right.

Joel Kellner: Being a Seahawks fan, I've already answered number three for Russell Wilson. So we'll do number 16. Tyler Lockett. So it's 16.

Japhet De Oliveira: All right. Hey, I like it. You've included the name, as well. That's great. All right, here we go. Sixteen. Tell us about one of the places you've traveled and why you want to go back.

Joel Kellner: Oh, this is a great question. So my wife and I, when we first got married, we went and lived in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico for six months.

Japhet De Oliveira: Oh, nice.

Joel Kellner: And we served in a church, helping kids learn English out by the dump in poverty. And we did some construction projects and my wife, she just finished nursing school. So she did a medical tent at this village that you could only get to by boat. Looking back on my life. It was this six months of just total immersion in a different culture. You are the outsider. They speak a different language and stuff and I'd love to just go back there again. And the warm weather, too, is, comparing it with Washington, is so nice.

Japhet De Oliveira: Hey, that's beautiful. That's beautiful. Oh, that's a good memory. And thanks for the service. That's great, as well. I think it's something beautiful about going and doing a stint of service like that. It's pretty good. Well done. All right. After 16 then, where next?

Joel Kellner: Let's keep with Seattle sports and go number 20, Gary Payton.

Japhet De Oliveira: OK. Right. Is it The Glove?

Joel Kellner: The Glove. Yes. You remember.

Japhet De Oliveira: Right. I remember, I remember. All right. I don't know anything about American sports, but occasionally, thanks to my father-in-law who's from Seattle, I remember some things. Right? Tell us about something you would rate 10 out of 10.

Joel Kellner: Oh, 10 out of 10. I think I would rate YouTube 10 out of 10. That's a platform that 20 years ago didn't even exist. And now you can go there for entertainment. You can go there for help. If you need anything, you just pick up your phone, go to the YouTube app and you can learn about a lot of different stuff. In fact, recently, my wife and I will start watching these channels and these people that have just interesting or different professions that you'd never know about. They record themselves at work and then you can watch along. And so there's this hoof trimmer in Wisconsin, like he trims cows' hooves.

And it's really interesting. All of his videos have a beginning, a middle and an end. And it's just something that you've never seen. That's pretty cool. And there's a guy in Mississippi who does bee removals. People will call him because a bee colony has built a place in their attic and now they're getting stung. And so he'll go there and extract the whole hive and save them and get the honey, give it to the homeowners and stuff. It's an amazing thing. So yeah, YouTube would definitely be a 10 out of 10 for me.

Japhet De Oliveira: I'd I was just going to ask you which ones you actually really like, but you've given that already. That's fantastic. Yeah. I'm thinking now of a hoof .... What did you call it? A hoof…

Joel Kellner: Yeah. He's called Nate the hoof guy.

Japhet De Oliveira: The hoof guy.

Joel Kellner: And he records videos of himself going from these farms, dairy farms, and these cows need to have healthy hooves so they can have babies and stuff, and they'll step on something and get these white line fractures and they'll have foot sores or whatever. And he just goes in there and cleans it all up and wraps it in salicylic acid and comes back and makes sure they're healing fine. Yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira: That's actually great. Wow. Never knew that, but I guess that's true. All right. Good. All right. Where'd you want to go next now?

Joel Kellner: So we just did 20. Let's do 23 for Michael Jordan, for the younger crowd. They would probably say LeBron James, but we'll say 23 is Michael Jordan.

Japhet De Oliveira: All right. All right, here we go. Tell us about the most outdated piece of technology you still regularly use. You just can't let go of it.

Joel Kellner: That's interesting. I actually, in front of me here, have this drawing tablet. And a lot of tablets today they have a screen on them, so you can see what you're drawing on. But this one, it looks more like a mousepad.

Japhet De Oliveira: For our listeners, you cannot see. It looks just like a mouse pad.

Joel Kellner: It looks like a mouse pad. And then there's this pen. It's called a Wacom tablet, an Intuos4. It has this pen and you draw on this mouse pad with this pen and you can't see what you're drawing, but computer knows. And so you have to look at the screen and draw with the pencil, but this is pretty outdated, I think.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah. So you've trained yourself to be able to look at the screen and draw on this. Yeah. Hey, that's great. That's great. I like it. How old is that piece?

Joel Kellner: Mmm, good question. I think it's probably 2006, 2007.

Japhet De Oliveira: Oh, that's ancient in technology. That's amazing. Well done. Well done for keeping it going. Right, good. All right. Where do you want to go next?

Joel Kellner: Let's jump up to 34. As a kid, this was the greatest athlete of all time. Played football and baseball. Bo Jackson. You never knew him.

Japhet De Oliveira: Well, like I said, I don't know a lot about American sports, but I will now have to go listen and look up.

Joel Kellner: Look him up. He has some of the greatest highlights ever in both sports Bo Jackson.

Japhet De Oliveira: That's good to be able to do two different types of sports. All right, 34 it is. Tell us about a moment that a person's kindness made a difference in your life. Hmm.

Joel Kellner: Trying to make me cry here.

Japhet De Oliveira: Well, I'm just saying. It is amazing, isn't it for other people to...

Joel Kellner: Yeah. We had four kids back to back to back every 18 months and life was really hard. In fact, we were struggling with three kids and we found out we were pregnant with our fourth kid. And we almost broke out in tears because it was...

Japhet De Oliveira: Hey, I hear you.

Joel Kellner: Difficult, whatever. But at the same time, we joined this group at our church called the Haven. And there was probably eight families in there in similar stages of life as we were. And we didn't get any help, really, after we had all of the first three kids, but when we had our fourth kid, for a whole month, that group of people brought us dinner every single night so we didn't have to make dinner for ourselves. And we just felt so loved and so cared for. I don't know, it brings me chills and tears welling up just thinking with gratitude for the kindness.

Japhet De Oliveira: I hear you. I hear you. It's hard to receive sometimes. Maybe it's easier to give. I don't know if you feel that same way, but for me, I feel like it's always easier to be able to give a gift than to receive a gift. But when you receive a gift, it's overwhelming.

Joel Kellner: Yeah. Definitely.

Japhet De Oliveira: It is nice actually. I mean, that's beautiful every night for the whole month, eh?

Joel Kellner: Yeah. As soon as we brought him home from the hospital, we had everything taken care of. Some people even bought diapers for us and we felt so love. So loved and cared for.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah. It really does make a difference when you belong to something bigger. It changes you doesn't it?

Joel Kellner: It does, definitely. Yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah. Hey, it's beautiful. Well, thanks for sharing that. That's great. All right. So where would you like to go next after 34?

Joel Kellner: Oh, might as well stick with Seattle sports icons and go to number 40. Shawn Kemp.

Japhet De Oliveira: OK. All right. I do remember that. All right. Shawn Kemp. Tell us about a time, Joel, that you have failed.

Joel Kellner: All right. Well, just this last Monday, we had to do virtual orientation without our main host. My teammate Cam Jones, my best friend at work, Cam Jones is normally the guy on the mic and he's a really dynamic, great personality. Great in front of people. But I feel more comfortable on the other side of the camera in the support role doing the producer type stuff. And anyway, I was asked to come and be the host for this group of new people. And every week before they're counting up numbers about who's going to attend. And we had 50 people in line. And then right before it's Friday, they said, "Actually it's going to be like 86 people." And then by Monday it was 102 people. And I just had so much anxiety that I was going to fail because of that. I'm like, "I'm not going to do well at this." But I turned it on and I'm sure I goofed it up compared to what Cam would've done. But I don't know if I call that a total failure, but it ended up working all right. I think the anxiety of thinking I would fail was worse than the actual failure itself.

Japhet De Oliveira: Huh. That is often the case though, isn't it? That we have the perception of what something is going to be or whether this will be received well, that can actually be harder than the actual action itself.

Joel Kellner: Yeah, I think so.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm with you. I'm with you in that. Well, I'm glad you did. You said a 100 and...

Joel Kellner: 102 people were on the call.

Japhet De Oliveira: 102. OK. 102 new people joining and all needing their orientation, so welcome. Welcome. I'm glad you brought them into the family, that's great. All right. Where do you want to go next after 40?

Joel Kellner: Oh, well, in high school basketball, my number was 42. So we'll go 42.

Japhet De Oliveira: All right. Hey, great. Tell us the story behind the photo on your cell phone. So what’s the photo on your cell phone and why that one?

Joel Kellner: All right. Yeah. So this is a picture of my wife and I. OK. A friend of mine, he's a personal trainer. And with that comes a lot of benefits and he got some tickets to go to a Washington Huskies football game. This, we're at the season opener. So we had found a babysitter for the kids and took a train up to Seattle. And this was a good memory. So we're inside there with the blue lights of the Washington State Huskies shining on us.

Japhet De Oliveira: Hey, that's nice. That's nice. Create all those memories. Create all those memories because it's so important. That's really good. Well, hey, that's beautiful. Good. All right, where after 42?

Joel Kellner: Mmm, we'll go to David Robinson. Number 50. For The San Antonio Spurs.

Japhet De Oliveira: OK. Here it is. Share about who has influenced you professionally.

Joel Kellner: Mmm.

Japhet De Oliveira: Mmm.

Joel Kellner: I really have two names that come to mind for this one. Do I have time to just talk about both of them?

Japhet De Oliveira: Yes, you do.

Joel Kellner: All right.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah, absolutely love it.

Joel Kellner: So the first one, his name is Michael Allison. And in fact, when we were living in Mexico, him and his wife came and visited and they had heard that there was this young couple and they wanted to meet us. And so they came to our apartment and I was upstairs on the balcony trying to learn how to program an Adobe Flash Professional, for those of you web developers who know anything about Flash. And he saw it and he tried to teach me some things. And my wife, she had just graduated nursing school, but needed a job. And he's like, "Why work for MultiCare Health System, you can come and maybe apply and just put my name as a reference and it'll maybe help you out."

And so she ended up working there and then two years later he was like, "Hey, I have a position on my team if you want to apply for it." And so I applied and I started there part-time for a little bit. And then eventually I got onboarded on the team and I'd worked there for maybe two or three years. And he's like, "You know if you want to really advance, you should get your master's degree." And I was like, "Master's degree. I'm a graphic designer and I don't have much." But I actually looked it up and enrolled in WGU, and for 18 months was staying up. I was a night owl at that time.

We'd put the kids in bed and then I'd stay up from 8 to 1 in the morning, reading and writing papers and stuff. But it was because of him that I even got the job in the first place. And then I got my master's degree. And then the second person I wanted to talk about was a boss of mine, Chris McKinzie. Actually on my behalf, I told her that I was in school for my master's degree. And at some time, I wanted to have the same job title as my other people. I was just an instructional designer, but I wanted to be a senior instructional designer.

And she's like, "You have a different job title than the other people on your team? Let me see what I can do about that." And so on her own time and whatever, she went and talked to HR and said, "Hey, I have this person, he's a really great employee. He does really great work. And he's in a school to get his master's degree. Could we get him to be in this new position?" And then a week or two weeks later, I got a phone call from HR saying, "Hey, how would you like a new job title? We'll pay you up some more money." And I'm like, "Yes, please."

Japhet De Oliveira: Yes, please.

Joel Kellner: And so that was really amazing. And that's actually how I got my foot in with Adventist Health, is that boss, she left MultiCare and started working for Adventist Health and she gave me a call to see if I could come and work. And originally I was going to have to be in person in Roseville and we had just moved. And so I couldn't move my family down there. I was like, "I would be interested, but I just can't do it right now." And then six months later, she's like, "Well, if I found a way for you to work from home, would you consider working for me?" And I was like, "That sounds like a good deal." She professionally has had a lot of influence, too.

Japhet De Oliveira: Hmm. It is actually wonderful to see other people, right, who believe in you and help pull out your potential. As I know that you'd do the same as well for others, as well. It's great to be able to see that stuff. And thanks for sharing for two people as well. That's beautiful. I like both those stories. Thanks. That's great. Inspiring to do the late 8 to 1 a.m. every day. Hey, that's heavy work. That's heavy work. Well done. Well done for doing that. I really think education makes a huge difference. So I'm a big fan, a big proponent of that. All right. Where next then?

Joel Kellner: Let's see, what number's else, 50?

Japhet De Oliveira: Yes.

Joel Kellner: All right. I'm running out. In sports numbers, there's really, the early on in the first half of the number set is a lot of really good players. And then it's like, after 50, you're in the offensive linemen and stuff. So I might have to jump high. We'll go number 80, either Steve Largent or Jerry Rice.

Japhet De Oliveira: OK. All right. Oh, well, here's a question of number 80. How would you like to change in the future? How would you like to change in the future?

Joel Kellner: I think I'd really like to learn empathy more. If you talk to my wife, she says I'm really blunt and really direct. And I'm not very empathetic and so that's a skill I…

Japhet De Oliveira: You can confess on the podcast. That's fine.

Joel Kellner: No, I see that in people, there's certain people I know that are just so empathetic. They share a story and they're like, "Oh, that's so hard for you. I'm sorry. That sounds difficult." They have that natural ability. A lot of friends of mine. I see them do that. And I'm like, "Man, I wish I had that skill." And so yeah, if I could change, I'd really want to learn to be more empathetic.

Japhet De Oliveira: Hey, I actually believe you have it in you. I believe you have it in you. Because I've seen the softer, empathetic side of you. And so I believe you have it. Pursue it with joy and passion. I'm looking forward to that. That's good. Good for you. It actually takes a lot to recognize both, as well. All right. So we have time for a couple more. So where do you want to go for your last two?

Joel Kellner: I'll say, number 88 and number 95. I don't have sports players for those, but we can end in the higher realm of the two.

Japhet De Oliveira: All right. All right, we'll go there then. Let's do 88 first and then we'll go to 95. So 88 is this. Joel, tell us about how your life has been different than what you imagined.

Joel Kellner: Ooh, that is a great question.

Japhet De Oliveira: Mmm, yes.

Joel Kellner: So growing up, I wasn't from a poor family, but I wasn't from a really wealthy family either. And I always thought I would get married sometime and I'd hoped that maybe I would own a house, but yeah, I never ... My life has been more blessed than I ever could have imagined.

Japhet De Oliveira: That's beautiful.

Joel Kellner: We moved in 2016 from a house in south Tacoma to one here in Puyallup. And I remember driving by the entrance sign for the neighborhood and it was called Crystal Ridge I'm like, "Oh man, those are rich people that live in there. I'll never have a house in Crystal Ridge." And then we ended up getting lucky and buying the house in 2016 and just having four really great kids. I'm humbled thinking about how blessed I am. Especially hearing stories of people struggling with infertility. We struggled a little bit before having kids, or just health issues in general. I didn't think I'd have a life this good, I'll put it that way.

Japhet De Oliveira: There you go, show your empathetic side, talking about ... Because it's true. There are many people who struggle to be able to have kids. And if you have kids, then you can easily take it for granted. That's easy. But it's a really difficult journey for those who can't have kids. So I'm with you. I'm with you. Hey, that's beautiful. I appreciate you sharing that, Joel. And so with that, we'll go to our last question then. Number 95. And this is actually interesting for you. So I'm amazed how this one ended up here, but tell us about how you see your faith and life intersecting.

Joel Kellner: Oh.

Japhet De Oliveira: Oh yeah.

Joel Kellner: It is an apex right here.

Japhet De Oliveira: I know. It seems like you couldn't have got a better question to end this on. Yeah.

Joel Kellner: Man. So this podcast, Japhet and I both work for Adventist Health and the mission statement of Adventist Health is living God's love by inspiring health, wholeness and hope.

Japhet De Oliveira: Yeah. Amen.

Joel Kellner: And that just resonates so deep within my soul. I'm so proud to work for a company where that's our mission statement and every day, I am a believer in the Bible, I'm a believer in God. I believe He's put us here to be in relationship with other people and to bring Him ultimate glory. There's a quote by John Piper that says, "God is most glorified in us when we are most satisfied in Him." And I think having satisfaction in God in all things, I'm so thankful that he's given me the talents that he's given me.

I'm so thankful to be working for organization that I work for, being able to do something I'm good at every day and to be appreciated and valued. And then just, we didn't really talk about this, but I joined the higher grounds community. And when I'm in there, I'm listening to what's said. And I try to put just a Godly comment in the comments section of just a way to try to encourage people in their faith, as well. It just resonates with me. So I feel like it doesn't just intersect. It's a full overlap spirituality in my life.

Japhet De Oliveira: I'm with you, Joel, on that. I love that Adventist health is a faith-based company. It makes the world of difference for inclusivity and for love, and for ... Actually, as you said so nicely, the connections that we have with each other is really important. No, that's really good. Hey, that's a beautiful answer, Joel. And I appreciate you sharing this. I also appreciate you taking your time just to come and spend some time here, sharing your stories, experiences. You're a great leader. Thank you for helping us with all of our teaching and online teaching and helping us in the company and grow in that area and thanks for your artistic gift. And I'm looking forward to your empathetic heart growing all the time because I think it's in you. I know it's in you. Just have to let it out the shell, so well done for that. Thanks, my friend.

For everybody who's listening, I just want to say to you that if you have a story or an experience, you should share it with your friends. You should listen to them, as well, because just like Joel and I talked right now, I'm learning, I'm changing and you will do the same, as well. And we can only just grow into a better place because of what we learn from each other. So God bless everybody. Joel, you take care.

Joel Kellner: Thank you.

Japhet De Oliveira: Thanks so much. See ya.

Narrator: Thank you for joining us for The Story & Experience Podcast. We invite you to read, watch and submit your story and experience at AdventistHealth.org/Story. The Story & Experience Podcast was bought to you by Adventist Health, through the Office of Culture.