Sam Leonor
Episode 3

Narrator:

Welcome, friends, to another episode of The Story & Experience Podcast. Join your host, Japhet De Oliveira, with his guest today, and discover the moments that shape us, our families, and communities.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Welcome to another episode of The Story & Experience Podcast. It's so wonderful to connect with another fresh guest. It's good to be able to be here online with everybody who's listening today. And, as you know if you've listened to us before, you kind of get the routine. But if you're brand new, this is the first time you're joining us, this is the way it works. I'm going to start off with asking a few questions, and then you'll find out the name of our guest and a little bit about the guest. And then we're going to open up to the rest of the questions. We have a hundred questions and our guest gets to go between 11 and 100 and choose the numbers. And as they go up higher in this scale, it'll get more difficult, and they get to choose whether they want to go higher or lower.

Japhet De Oliveira:

What's the reason we're doing this? It's because one of the most beautiful things that we can do is just share moments and experiences that take place in our life that shape us. And this is kind of like a great tradition that we have in our lives, where we get to pause and connect with each other. Imagine you have a cup of tea sitting down, you're talking to your friends and that's what takes place right now.

Japhet De Oliveira:

So I'm very excited right now to begin this one here and this episode. And so let's begin by just asking what's your name? Is there anything that we should know about how we pronounce your name that has been slaughtered in the past? So sir, tell us.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah, so my name is Sam and my last name is Leonor, but thanks for asking about the pronunciation. It is a Spanish name, so it's actually "Lay-o-nor".

Japhet De Oliveira:

"Lay-o-nor," all right.

Sam Leonor:

"Lay-o-nor." But to make it easy for English speakers, we, my family, just chooses to say Lenore, or there's a section of the family that says "Lee-o-nore." I prefer "Lenore".

Japhet De Oliveira:

Lenore. Did I do that right?

Sam Leonor:

You know, J...

Japhet De Oliveira:

You know, I don't think I've done it right.

Sam Leonor:

Oh my goodness. How many years?

Japhet De Oliveira:

I feel like I'm so not part of the family now. I feel...

Sam Leonor:

You and I have last names, you understand. We have last names that are not the easiest to pronounce, so we just accept, right? So someone says your name, you just say, "I accept whatever you said as your best attempt. Let's just move on."

Japhet De Oliveira:

It's great. It's great. Oh, that's fantastic. Sam. Thank you so much, Sam. Sam, what do you do for work at the moment?

Sam Leonor:

So, yeah, I oversee the work of spiritual care for Adventist Health.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's great.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. It is great. It's incredibly fulfilling and satisfying work.

Japhet De Oliveira:

And how long have you been doing that?

Sam Leonor:

J, I'm coming up on two years. June 24, 2021, is my two-year anniversary. And I know that is also your anniversary at this same organization because we began together.

Japhet De Oliveira:

We do. We may even have a little anniversary party every time.

Sam Leonor:

We should.

Japhet De Oliveira:

We should actually start that tradition. That would be great.

Sam Leonor:

No, that's fantastic.

Japhet De Oliveira:

So when you say spiritual care, what does that mean for somebody who doesn't quite grasp that?

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. So it's the work of chaplaincy. That's how most people know it. The people who care for our patients who are having the most difficult day of their life sometimes, our patients who need care of the soul and the spirit, patients and their families who are finding themselves lost in the middle of the decisions or in the middle of their health deteriorating. So that's our team. Our team provides that.

Sam Leonor:

We also have a team of bereavement providers. If there's a loss in your family, we have some team members who provide long-term care for families who have lost a loved one. Yeah. That's the work we do. And then sometimes I participate also in the work of mission, helping our organization align to our missional values. That's some of the other work I do and that I find, again, incredibly satisfying and fulfilling.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Sam, that's a very generous and very small description of what you do because I know you and you are so gifted at this and it's brilliant what you do, and you're fantastic with this. So for anybody who, if you haven't met Sam, you should meet Sam. And if you haven't heard him speak, or if you haven't actually been in his pastoral care, or been part of his life. Oh, Sam, it's a pleasure to have you on here. So this is great.

Japhet De Oliveira:

All right. Let's just go back into the tent here though, because this is just the beginning, right? So let's dive in. Morning. In the morning, what's your choice to drink in the morning. Do you have water first? Do you have one of those green liquid smoothies? Is it a coffee? Is it tea? What's your first drink of the day?

Sam Leonor:

Is this question one? It's already hard. Does the scale include like negative one? Can we go to the negative world first? I feel this is way too revealing. It's too intimate of a question, Japhet. We should start with something. Nah, I'm joking. So, no. I used to be ... I was a one cup of coffee in the morning kind of person, early in the morning to get me going. But over the last year, I've been all over the place. I've given up coffee for six months. Then I got into drinking some tea in the morning. Now I'm in the middle of a matcha season of my life. So I make myself a little matcha latte in the morning. But I can feel coffee coming back. I can sense it, that it's just around the corner. I'm going to be back to the morning coffee routine.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Real soon. Real soon. All right. All right.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. Partly because I miss the ritual of making a good cup of coffee.

Japhet De Oliveira:

So for you it's not just pushing a button. For you it's a ritual.

Sam Leonor:

Oh, no!

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh, I said something bad there.

Sam Leonor:

No, no. For me it's the opening of the bag, smelling the whole beans, measuring them properly, making sure you've got the right weight, then grinding them to the proper size, and then pouring over water at 207 degrees slowly through the beans, letting them bloom. That ritual I think, all joking aside, is like a morning meditation that I kind of miss because there's not that with a little cup of tea. Sorry. No offense to you British people.

Japhet De Oliveira:

No. There is actually a beautiful process of making tea as well. And I would say that some people may want to be the coffee bean in your care. And some people may want to be the teabag in my care, but that's OK. It's OK. It's all good.

Sam Leonor:

Even the terms, listen to that. Teabag and coffee bean. Even that is just the world of difference.

Japhet De Oliveira:

It depends how you pronounce teabag, and so... All right, hey Sam, where were you born?

Sam Leonor:

Oh, I was born on the beautiful island, the Caribbean of Puerto Rico.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh wow.

Sam Leonor:

And when you say it with that flare the listener who's been there will know. They will know what I'm talking about.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Have you ever been back?

Sam Leonor:

On five different occasions, so I can count them on one hand.

Japhet De Oliveira:

To the location where you were born, to the hospital?

Sam Leonor:

Yeah, yeah.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh, good.

Sam Leonor:

Because it is an Adventist hospital and it is the place where there's a lot of history connected to that hospital. It's where my parents met. My dad was a young accountant. My mother was a nurse, a recently graduated nurse. They met there. My two older sisters were born there. I was born there. And it's also where my father and my mother received their call to what became essentially a lifelong commitment and calling to Adventist healthcare. So yeah, I'm very connected to that facility in Mayaguez, Puerto Rico.

Japhet De Oliveira:

I love how you say that. That's fantastic. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. All right. So when you were a child, did you imagine that you were going to be in charge of all spiritual care for a health system? Is that what you dreamed of.

Sam Leonor:

No, Japhet. When I was a child, I was going to be an astronaut. Weren't you? Weren't all of us?

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's great. To visit the moon or somewhere further?

Sam Leonor:

No. To visit the visit galaxies far away.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh, OK.

Sam Leonor:

Look, of course not. This was not in my master plan for my life, as no child's life is. But depending on what you say, childhood, what stage in life you're talking about. But I did begin to understand some time in my adolescence that my path was going to be similar to my parents, in some way caring for the well-being of people. I didn't know in what capacity, but I just knew. I began to understand what my folks did, what our community was doing, the work of the community I was being raised by, the commitments they had made. I began to see the DNA-level inculcation or implantation of that mission in my soul. And I knew it was my destiny to do something in this world [with] the well-being of people. But I did not know at that time that it would be spiritual care. That became clear later in life.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's great. That's great. So Sam, you've spoken before 40,000 people. You've spoken to, like, five people. You've spoken  all over the world. Would somebody describe you as an introvert or an extrovert, and would you agree with that description?

Sam Leonor:

Where are we in the questions?

Japhet De Oliveira:

We're still in 10. We're still in the top 10.

Sam Leonor:

Wow.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Simple stuff.

Sam Leonor:

I am blown away. I would love to see that list, to see what 99 is, or 100 is.

Japhet De Oliveira:

One hundred, yeah.

Sam Leonor:

First of all, you're an affirmer. I call you the affirmer in chief because you affirm and you build people up, and I love that about you. Thank you for saying such kind of things. When you say 40,000 people, you failed to mention that it was 40,000 people, average age, probably 14.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah, which is actually even harder to retain their attention, right?

Sam Leonor:

I agree. Yes. Thanks for pointing that out. Yes.

Japhet De Oliveira:

And you did.

Sam Leonor:

So the introvert-extrovert question... I think what most public speakers will tell you, and what I think lots of people who listen to speakers will find very surprising, is that we lean introvert. All right, now I'm not going to say I'm an introvert. I will just say that I'm a perfectly balanced individual. I really love interaction. I love it. I love being with people. I relish contact, but I can also feel my batteries depleting when I'm doing that, and not recharging, which I think is the sign. If you recharge in private, that's the sign that you probably lean introvert. So for me, it's not about your preference or your skill or what you prefer to be. I think it's about how your batteries get charged.

Japhet De Oliveira:

OK. OK. I like that. I like that. That's a great description, insight there. Let's talk about some of your habits.

Sam Leonor:

When do I get to ask questions, by the way?

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh yes. Actually, that's a really great question. And I think we should do that in the next series of the podcast.

Sam Leonor:

I would like to be a guest host soon.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Soon.

Sam Leonor:

To interview you.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That will be fun. Let's talk about habits. Are you an early morning riser or late night owl?

Sam Leonor:

No, I'm early. Hey, you know what's interesting? Is that was not always the case.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Huh.

Sam Leonor:

No. Because as you know, I spent 20 years in college ministry, university ministry. And if you're pastoring college students, university students...

Japhet De Oliveira:

It's late night.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah, exactly. Really you're on from about 2:00 p.m. until 2:00 p.m. That's really when you need to be available. So, yeah. But really that was really a fight for 20 years against what I think my natural inclination is, which is early morning.

Japhet De Oliveira:

So early morning. So what was the first thought you had this morning?

Sam Leonor:

Oh wow. When my eyes opened?

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yes. As soon as they opened, what's the first thing you thought of?

Sam Leonor:

I thought, "I am recording a podcast with Japhet today."

Japhet De Oliveira:

I'm glad that was the first thought you had. That's great. That's good. Good priorities. Mine is sometimes, "Oh, where's my phone. And will it be in focus? Will my eyes be in focus?"

Sam Leonor:

The right answer should be, a pastor like me, and if my team is listening, and my team of pastors is listening, I said, "I thought about God," and the sense of peace flooded my mind. But probably not. Actually, I could probably tell you what I thought when I woke up this morning was I thought, "I hope my leg, my running injury, is healed enough so I can actually go for a run today." Actually, no. I probably moved my leg around as soon as I woke up thinking, "I wonder if I could do it today?" Because it's been three or four weeks since I've been able to run it and I'm feeling like I need it.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That is good. That is good. Three or four weeks is better than 34 years. That's great. Well done. Let me ask you a leadership question. Are you a backseat driver?

Sam Leonor:

Are there other options?

Japhet De Oliveira:

No, just that. Are you a backseat driver?

Sam Leonor:

Oh, wow. If it's one of my teenage children driving, most definitely.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh, OK. Qualifier.

Sam Leonor:

But if it's my spouse, I bite on my tongue very hard, and do not say anything.

Japhet De Oliveira:

If you close your eyes, it's not real.

Sam Leonor:

Listen. So this is a real question.

Japhet De Oliveira:

It's a real question.

Sam Leonor:

For me, I backseat drive when I have no confidence in the person behind the wheel. So with you, if I may speak about you for example.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Don't go there.

Sam Leonor:

Riding with you is frightening. You review your life often when you're riding with Japhet.

Japhet De Oliveira:

It's because in England we have freedom to drive at a different pace.

Sam Leonor:

You have speed limits. I've driven in England. You have speed limits too, so. But you know what's interesting? I have confidence when you're driving, because I know Japhet would not be driving a hundred miles an hour around this corner... If Japhet was not aware or confident in the parameters of this vehicle he is driving, and the ability to corner at that speed, or his own experience and ability cornering in wet pavement at this speed. So I would say if you're driving at that speed, I don't comment because I know you've got it. But if it was someone that I didn't know, or someone who has displayed a consistent pattern of not being able to drive safely, then the commentary would be flowing from me.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That is good.

Sam Leonor:

And if we're going to extrapolate this to leadership...

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yes.

Sam Leonor:

To actual leadership.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yes.

Sam Leonor:

Probably same.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's true. It's true. It's true. All right. Now the floor is open, Sam. So now you get to pick, right? You get to pick a number between 11 and 100. And as I said, the closer you get to 100, I wouldn't recommend 100 because 100 is the hardest question out of all of these questions, the more vulnerable and more difficult these questions are. Some of them are very light. They're scattered and intentionally, and some are very deep. And you get to see how you go.

Sam Leonor:

How much time do we have left so I know how to gauge my...

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh. We're only just about a third of the way.

Sam Leonor:

That's impossible. We've been talking for 30 minutes, J. That's impossible. Hey, also, are there actual questions or do you formulate them as we go?

Japhet De Oliveira:

No. I have them on a beautiful digital sheet here that scrolls silently.

Sam Leonor:

OK. Yeah. So this is real? OK.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah. It's real. And so as people listen to the podcast, if they start to write these questions down, they're like, "Oh, I know. When he says 27, I know what the question is." And eventually, yeah.

Sam Leonor:

Eventually they'll know.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Eventually they'll know. Yeah.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. And they'll probably hope that someone asks the question 100.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah, yeah. So where do you want to go?

Sam Leonor:

No, listen. I'm choosing one. Are you kidding me? I'm going with one.

Japhet De Oliveira:

It starts with 11.

Sam Leonor:

I'm testing this out.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Eleven for you.

Sam Leonor:

Oh, we've already done?

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah. We've done the first 10. Yeah.

Sam Leonor:

Let's do 11.

Japhet De Oliveira:

All right. Tell us about the most adventurous meal you've ever eaten. The burrito or what?

Sam Leonor:

No. So, hey, this is awesome. I'm glad you're asking this question because I actually know the answer to that.

Japhet De Oliveira:

I know. I know.

Sam Leonor:

On a trip to Cambodia doing some good work with my good friend, Rod Long, who you know, I ate a piece of a tarantula dipped in a very delicious sauce, chili lime sauce. And immediately after that, I had a boiled silk worm, which tasted like creamed corn. It was delicious. Once you get past the thought of what you're doing, both of those things. The tarantula, the texture was horrific. I'll just tell you that. But the silkworm, I would have a bowl full of that. Delicious.

Japhet De Oliveira:

I am very happy for you. I don't know if I'd be that brave at all. All right. Good.

Sam Leonor:

Well the thing is, it was offered to us, and the smile with which the person who was giving it to us and the pride that you could see in their eyes said, "You don't really have an option here." If you care about people, you're going to eat whatever they hand you.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh, that's great. That's great. All right. Where are you going to go next? After 11? Only up.

Sam Leonor:

No, let's do 13.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Thirteen. All right, here we go. Walk us through the ideal end of your day.

Sam Leonor:

Oh, wow. Yeah. OK. A warm drink. This is not in order of importance, by the way. I'm just throwing it out there.

Japhet De Oliveira:

No. I'm wondering where the slippers are coming, but warm drink.

Sam Leonor:

Warm drink. Long conversation with Shelley, my wife. No red badges anywhere on my screens. You know what I mean? No emails on red. No text messages on red. No unreturned text messages. That's important to me. And a chapter or two in some literature that I'm finding inspiring, not because of work, but just inspiring. Something that I love that is nursing my soul. A couple of chapters in that. And yeah.

Sam Leonor:

Now I'll tell you this. I have an ability that my wife detests about me. So I fall asleep immediately after closing my eyes. Sometimes I fall asleep on my way to bed. Like I know it's over.

Japhet De Oliveira:

I have the same ability.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. And it takes her a lot longer. So once my head hits the pillow, it's over. There's no conversation. There's nothing going on. Because it takes her so long, she's always, "Oh, how do you do that? Why can't we talk a little longer?" I know. It's I have a very clear conscience. You probably should explore what's going on in your own mind and soul as to why you can't. You're the same, huh?

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh, yeah. Yeah, I am the same. I am the same absolutely. I can lay my head down, I'm like instant. Yeah.

Sam Leonor:

Can you sleep anywhere?

Japhet De Oliveira:

Pretty much. Pretty much.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah, me too.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah. Just I can find a spot...

Sam Leonor:

Does that mean we're always in a constant state of exhaustion and sleep deprivation?

Japhet De Oliveira:

It could be. It could be. I don't know. Let's not talk to Jeff Egler about it. He's our doctor.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah, Doc, if you're listening, please don't put this on our next conversation piece that we've got to discuss with you.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Good. Good. All right. What number now?

Sam Leonor:

Fifteen.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Fifteen. All right, brilliant. Here we go. What's this the one thing that you always misplace, Sam?

Sam Leonor:

My AirPods.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Oh yeah. The whole case or just the AirPods on their own?

Sam Leonor:

All of it. There is someone out there who rode in an Uber after I did that has a very nice, almost brand-new AirPods. There is probably somebody in a hotel, like a hotel employee, probably someone that cleans rooms that has beautiful, beautiful AirPods. Almost new also. There's probably somebody at an airport that got lucky. I'm showing, right, because you can see me. I'm showing you. This is number five.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's good.

Sam Leonor:

And it's probably the last one according to...

Japhet De Oliveira:

You are a blessing. You're a blessing to so many others. You've given AirPods. You're blessing people with sound and beautiful moments. This is good. You're teaching. You're helping people with moments. That's great.

Sam Leonor:

I don't know. This probably sends a signal that I'm not very responsible...

Japhet De Oliveira:

Would you feel the same way about your kids if they lost their AirPods? That's not a question. That's not a question by the way. All right. Which number next?

Sam Leonor:

Sixteen.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Sixteen. All right, here we go.

Sam Leonor:

I'm nervous about these.

Japhet De Oliveira:

I know. This is great. Tell us about one of the places you've traveled and why you want to go back.

Sam Leonor:

Oh, that's a tough one.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yes, it's very hard because now you're thinking, if I say this place, the people who are listening are thinking, do I not like their place?

Sam Leonor:

Yeah, no. Yeah, exactly.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's exactly it. Yeah. Yeah.

Sam Leonor:

Man, you see, and I also don't want to be a travel brag guy.

Japhet De Oliveira:

No, no. Just choose England, that's fine.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. England. England, you know it's weird. England was always the stereotypical England when I visited. Overcast, cold, and not just cold but cold to the bone.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's actually true. It's true.

Sam Leonor:

I'm sorry, man.

Japhet De Oliveira:

It's true. It's a very unique coolness to it. Which country?

Sam Leonor:

Look, I think the problem with that question is not only that there's so many amazing places on the road, it's that I've come to the conclusion that there's also a state of mind you are in when you visit a place that complements the reason why you remember it so fondly and you love it. So the place that came to mind immediately may not be because of the beauty, although it was beautiful, or because it's all the pieces that you prefer are there, the ocean, et cetera, but probably because of what was happening in my life at the time.

Sam Leonor:

My family and I, when the kids were young, my son was 5, daughter was 8 years old. I took a sabbatical, is what they called it in when I was in academic work. A two-month sabbatical and we spent it traveling in Central America, in places where I grew up. We spent three days in what's called the Nicoya peninsula of Costa Rica in the little town called Montezuma, which is away from tourist world. It's just a perfect little location on a bay. And those three days to me were so... It was transcendent on so many levels. I felt a connection to my family that was incredible. I felt a connection to God, a connection to people around me. The food we're eating was just, it felt like you were eating nourishing [food] and ingredients that are meant for your body. The coffee was amazing. The views, the weather, it was heaven. It was heaven for me on earth. So all that. Probably being on a long break contributed to it. So all of that made that place unforgettable and, yeah, I would choose that today. I would choose that.

Japhet De Oliveira:

I like that qualifier. That's really good. That's really good. Well, we have time for a couple more and then it's a wrap. So where do you want to go? The last two?

Sam Leonor:

I'm going to go crazy, J.

Japhet De Oliveira:

OK. All right.

Sam Leonor:

Let's jump.

Japhet De Oliveira:

OK.

Sam Leonor:

Fifty.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Fifty. All right. Here we go.

Sam Leonor:

I'm doing it.

Japhet De Oliveira:

All right, 50. Share about who has influenced you professionally.

Sam Leonor:

Yeah. OK. It's got to be more than one?

Japhet De Oliveira:

It's up to you, the floor is yours.

Sam Leonor:

OK. I'll say it's my father first of all. I have a good dad. And I know that God blessed me with not just a really, really, really good dad, but also a remarkable human being in general. When I think about Jesus, to get deep into faith work, faith, I think about the qualities of Jesus, the values that Jesus lived by. If I cannot attain the goal of being like Jesus, I tell myself, then just at least be like your dad. Just an all-around amazing human being. His character, the way he treats people, the ways he taught me to treat people. And then his business sense, because he was a businessman, you know? The way he conducted himself in business with integrity. His love of his work, his love of his family, his commitments, his boundaries. He's not perfect, but man, I think one of the biggest blessings on the list of blessings that I was given by God was to have this amazing man in my life.

Sam Leonor:

I was telling someone the other day, because his health is declining, and I told somebody the other day, "I am having a really hard time imagining the world without my dad in it." And I know people probably listening to this, me saying this, they probably think, "This is sweet. I did not have a great dad and, or maybe not someone that I could pattern my life after that." So when I hear those stories of dads that weren't that great, I'm even more grateful. I grieve for people who didn't have that kind of blessing. But I'm even more grateful for the dad I had. And I know that my kids, it's like a generational gift that just keeps going. Right? My kids had a better dad in me because of what I had.

Sam Leonor:

And one last thing I'll say. My dad, he did not have a great dad. He had to break some intergenerational cycles of ugliness that were not easy to break, which makes him an even more amazing human being, so that I could have, and my siblings and his grandkids could have, again, this blessing of just a better future, better life.

Japhet De Oliveira:

That's a beautiful story, Sam. And I actually think that even painful things are beautiful because we learn through them as well. So yeah, I appreciate that a lot. Thanks for sharing. Last number?

Sam Leonor:

Sixty.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Sixty it is. All right. Let's go then. Sam, when in life have you felt most alone?

Sam Leonor:

That is personal.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah.

Sam Leonor:

That is very, very, very personal. First thing that comes to mind is a season of my life when I... There have been two seasons that were similar. One was dramatically different because of what I'll say in a moment. But the first season was, when you're a public speaker, you open yourself up to criticism and to... When you're up front, or you're leading in any kind of capacity, there are people who don't mean you well, see the exposed, tender parts of you, and they immediately zero in and they go after it. Right?

Sam Leonor:

So there was a season of my life when that was happening. There was an organized effort to essentially cause me injury. And it felt incredibly and devastatingly lonely to face that alone. What I felt like was alone. But then I faced a similar season a decade later, another organized sort of effort to demoralize, destabilize, or attack you for things you were saying that you were convicted of.

Sam Leonor:

But at that time, I had a group of friends around me, a group of brothers and sisters who were in the same boat with me. And what a difference that made. And you were one of those, by the way. You were one of those people, a decade later, who, what a difference it makes, J, when you are united like that. When you know someone really has your back.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Yeah, yeah.

Sam Leonor:

And someone can tell you, "Sam, you're not crazy. The things you're saying are not crazy." And also the people who are around you can tell you, "That thing you said is crazy. That doesn't mean that everything else you've said is crazy." Just having that kind of community and support around you makes all the difference. All the difference.

Japhet De Oliveira:

Sam, I want to thank you for taking the time to join us on The Story & Experience Podcast. You are called for this role with Adventist Health, and you're such a blessing to the company. But you're a blessing to so many people's lives around the globe. It is a privilege. And I know that you love to prepare for everything, so for everybody that's listening, this was a big deal for Sam to actually come here and not know any question, not know what the numbers were. And I thank you for your honesty, authenticity, which is actually who you are. It's your character. It's what everybody has inside them as well. So thank you for sharing and encouraging others to share as well. Appreciate you, brother. God bless you. You take care. For all our listeners who are listening, may you have an amazing day and be blessed as well.

Narrator:

Thank you for joining us for The Story & Experience Podcast. We invite you to read, watch, and submit your story and experience at adventisthealth.org/story. The Story & Experience Podcast was brought to you by Adventist Health through the Office of Culture